Another DataQuick update has median prices for Los Angeles County flat-lined for five months now. Although we've long since known that LA County median prices have very little relationship with Westside prices.
Median prices remain down 45.5% for Los Angeles County from its peak in August 2007. Volumes were up 20% year-to-year from May 2008. (
April DataQuick post)
This leaves Los Angeles County prices at April 2003. Prices for the other three counties have turned up slightly: Orange County at June 2003, Ventura County at March 2003, and San Diego at February 2002.
Wednesday, June 17, 2009
May DataQuick
Subscribe to:
Post Comments (Atom)
127 comments:
New State Law Delays Foreclosures For 90 Days
Posted: June 15, 2009 07:08 PM PDT
Updated: June 15, 2009 07:11 PM PDT
http://www.760kfmb.com/Global/story.asp?S=10537862
90 more days of fake support for the CA market
looks like prices are creeping up.
"looks like prices are creeping up"
LOL. Yeah totally, we should all rush out and buy now or forever be priced out! Thanks Realtor!
Damn, we all missed the bottom and will be bitter renters foreverrrrrrrr.........
Bottom: February 2009.
It's official: Pretty much everybody who works at UCLA(and I mean staff AND faculty) is getting an 8% paycut this summer. So much for that housing bottom. If they're rolling our salaries back to 2002 levels, you'd better believe prices on the Westside are rolling back at least that far, too.
"Pretty much everybody who works at UCLA(and I mean staff AND faculty) is getting an 8% paycut this summer."
The times where UCLA faculty or staff could actually afford to live on the Westside have long passed anyways.
prices are not rising, and not going down MUCH in SM....another 10-15% prob.
UCLA alert:
8% reduction on a 90-100K salary doesn't mean shit
The times where UCLA faculty or staff could actually afford to live on the Westside have long passed anyways.
Wow. Proof positive that the Realturds who post on this blog don't know what they're talking about, or for that matter live on the westside of L.A.
"Wow. Proof positive that the Realturds who post on this blog don't know what they're talking about, or for that matter live on the westside of L.A."
Not a realtor at all- I was the one who wrote the original comment, and I'm tenured UCLA faculty. My wife and I are simply unable to afford a house on the Westside, as is just about everyone in my department who arrived in LA during the last 5 or 6 years- they all rent in faculty housing. As a matter of fact, quite a number of people have left again because of the unaffordability of housing. It's a serious problem for the university.
Living in faculty housing is kind of cool. Lots of interesting people to hang around with and socialize with.
Many of us like having interesting neighbors
"Living in faculty housing is kind of cool. Lots of interesting people to hang around with and socialize with."
Yes, maybe, but not a permanent solution.
I currently rent North of Montana and am a little disappointed in my neighbors - mostly entertainment industry people and other types I don't really enjoy being around - are there any micro neighborhoods on the West Side that contain mostly academics, public thinkers, and other interesting types - I can't live in faculty housing and am wondering where these people are - I moved here from Berkeley and I miss mostly being around academics
I would also love to know any micro-neighborhoods where professor/academic, doctors or highly educated professionals live....we live in Manhattan and are thinking about moving to SoCal next year...we would love to live near other highly educated professionals.
Oh well, I don't want to disappoint you, but Santa Monica cannot really be compared to Berkeley (I have also lived in both places) ... although SM sometimes prides itself of being such an intellectual place, in reality, it isn't. Its single-family (not condo) neighborhoods are dominated by retirees (or people close to retirement- those who have been living there for 40 years), financial- or entertainment industry types, self-made entrepreneurs etc. Not the artistic/intellectual/academic crowd you're looking for.
UCLA faculty and other academics (even doctors) have long ago been priced out (unless they have a high-earning spouse or are independently wealthy).
Your best bet for finding single-family neighborhoods with academics, these days, would be Culver City- but it's not clear whether one still considers that Westside.
micro-neighborhoods where professor/academic, doctors or highly educated professionals live
I recall the area around Veteran south of National having some older UCLA professors in modest '50s houses. Don't know if younger ones have joined them there, though.
I'd like to hear from others on this; I'd also like interesting neighbors!
Also see the 6/4 comment on 21st Place north of Montana neighbors vs. Sunset Park.
"Your best bet for finding single-family neighborhoods with academics, these days, would be Culver City- but it's not clear whether one still considers that Westside."
Seriously? I don't think that LA has any analogue to Berkeley, and if it does, it's certainly not Culver City. There are educated people -- professors, doctors, lawyers, professionals, etc -- pretty much everywhere since LA is so sprawling, both in terms of real estate and jobs. The only place I can really think of that probably has a higher concentration of true "intellectuals" is Pasadena near Cal Tech and JPL, and that's definitely not on the westside.
I also like arty geeky crowds, having previously lived in Manhattan, New England, Berkeley and LaJolla (the last being merely beautiful, not so much arty or geeky). If it weren't for my job in LA, a couple of those places (or Vancouver, which I love) are more appealing to me, than LA. Am currently renting in SM, N of Wilshire, thinking to buy in the next year or so, but not set on a hood. Any thoughts? Venice/Ocean Park W of Lincoln has a good vibe but is way congested. Where I am renting is ok, jogging ok, people also ok but a little boring and NIMBY; altho the same now could be said of me or anyone else with a high stress desk job - who used to be an interesting person, and who used to have time to hang out with neighbors.
I have lived in academic communities for many years - most recently in Cambridge, Mass
and I have to be in Los Angeles for work for a while - I am also looking for a stretch of a few blocks filled with academics and thinkers -
Someone once told me that Southeast Beverly Hills was like that at one point but not anymore -
It is different here in LA - the nice areas seem filled up with self made business men - not that there is anything wrong with that but it is not my crowd
By the way check out sabaticalhomes.com for list of professors and academics who are looking to do home exchanges with people in Los Angeles either for vacation or for short temporary stays
Micro neighborhoods with public thinkers? I can't imagine what that means, like Plato and Aristotle leading a forum of enthralled masses leaning on their every word? I don't think that happens anymore. In Santa Monica we have batshit insane people scream nonsense on the promenade. That's about as close as you will get around here.
Do we really need to live near professors/artists/counter-culture leaders/etc? I feel like if you are seeking this out on this blog then you are not one and just wish to check off some box on your list of friendships, like having a gay, an african-american, and an amputee (or some other mix depending on your background).
Try moving to Elysian Heights or Atwater Village. You'll get that in spades. Or, just sit back and realize that if can afford to own a home on the west side you probably "sold out" at some point and you won't be surrounded by the above-mentioned folk. Well, that's not exactly true. There is the option to become a benefactor by snaring one as your spouse. That's the the west side way. Enjoy it.
Westchester has LMU professors. I UCLA prof I know lives in PP, but he bought before the bubble. Culver City has some neighborhoods with interesting mixes. I liked living in 90404, it is a nieghborhood no man's land and we had a very interesting neighborhood mix, although heavy on singles and we are a family with kids. The people I know in Sunset Park are very interesting. Overall I'd recommend moving further south.
All over here people work all the time. My husband started grad school at age 39 and could not believe how little the academics worked compared to industry. He went back to industry when he got out because he had a family to support. There is a reason academics earn less than their industry counterparts and the choice is very much one of lifestyle.
I also know academic types in Beverlywood, but that is way to expensive still.
I'm also an east coast trained academic. I've been here for a couple of years and haven't found the neighborhood you desribed either. I've heard that Silver Lake might be like that, but there's no discount on price there (if you're like me and can tell the difference between 6 and 800k). I think other posters are right LA is so huge and so expensive there are no academic enclaves.
Well it is pretty sad that there are no academic enclaves - I want my kids to grow up with the right values.
Parents can't instill the right values all by themselves - need to be around the right environment.
Cambridge, Ithaca, Madison, Providence, all of these cities have a neighborhood that is very intellectual and academic
Sad that LA hasn't yet developed this
Academic enclaves? Who cares. I want to know where I can live in a high-end area but also with access to plenty of single, young hot chicks. I think Manhattan Beach is the Valhalla of such areas, but the high-end portion within the first block from the water is bit much to afford even for me--I don't want a small condo!
"He went back to industry when he got out because he had a family to support. There is a reason academics earn less than their industry counterparts and the choice is very much one of lifestyle."
I would beg to disagree. You don't end up as faculty at a prestigious place like UCLA without putting up with an enormous workload.
As it happens often in the public discussion of universities, I think you might be very much confusing the teaching load with the other obligations of professors, most importantly, research.
Let's not let this degrade in to a pissing match between professors and the other professions.
Every profession in Los Angeles has a gripe -
My best friend from college went to medical school back when a medical degree was a guaranteed ticket to living in the Franklin school district. By the time he finished his residency the prices of nice houses in Franklin had gone over 3 million and he realized that he could never ever afford to live there. Imagine how bitter he is with all that education, not being able to live in a place he expected to live in
My point is everyone here in LA is bitter and angry about something or the other
To our single friend - you sound like a refugee from the "Roissy in DC" blog
go to a few open houses in MB - the cost of construction is the same there as it is here, but land is much more expensive -
even today, post crash, vacant land in the decent part of manhattan beach ("west of highland avenue") costs $35 million dollars an acre.
That compares to $9 million an acre for land in Santa Monica - yes that is right four times as much for the land
If you can't afford Santa Monica you certainly can't afford the decent part of MB
Why is it the more I visit this blog, the more I feel like I should move to another state? "I am an east coast trained academic"! Wow! What exactly is that, a Ph.D in sociology? Please invite me to your house and I'll have the nanny watch the kids an extra few hours so you can explain why our society is in the toilet.
11:56
Why are you choosing to dump on the academics and intellectuals on this site instead of the lothario that posted about the local pick up scene?
Seems to me you have some much richer targets here - ignore the professors please
A PhD in engineering followed by a career researching new battery technologies and educating future engineers= worthy of praise and esteem.
A PhD in sociology followed by a career teaching sociology to college kids, plus a few irrelevant articles= whatever.
There is indeed open warfare between the professors in engineering and the professors in the humanities. But this blog is not the place for that battle to take place.
What we have here are professors that want to live only among other professors, not among the type that lives in the 90402.
Why do you assume that they exclude engineering professors - ? the open issue here is an enclave for professors - where is it located
I'm simply asking these self-proclaimed "academics" for some details about their incredible backgrounds. I am guessing (and I'm sure I'm right) that these incredibly pompous east coast trained academics have PhDs in areas that enable them to do exactly one thing- teach stupid college kids looking for some easy elective courses. Which then begs the question- where does all that pomposity come from?
"I'm simply asking these self-proclaimed "academics" for some details about their incredible backgrounds."
What is your background?
"I am guessing (and I'm sure I'm right) that these incredibly pompous east coast trained academics have PhDs in areas that enable them to do exactly one thing- teach stupid college kids looking for some easy elective courses."
No, you're not right. I have a PhD (though not "east coast trained") and am a tenured faculty member at UCLA- in a "hard" science.
I'm not sure, however, why you think the question posed by the "east coast trained academic" was worthy of your vitriol. He or she simply stated that it was hard to find a neighborhood in LA mainly populated by people who work in an intellectual field.
The city is too big and spread out to have these so-called academic enclaves. The best you can hope for is some decent schools, a low crime rate, above-average circulation, and interesting neighbors with an above-average intellect. This discussion is going nowhere. Things are different in Ithaca.
what do you mean above average circulation
is that a reference to the speed of traffic or something
What neighborhood in SM gurantees that I'll by the furthest possibly from any east coast trained liberal academics?
"What neighborhood in SM gurantees that I'll by the furthest possibly from any east coast trained liberal academics?"
The trailer park next to I 10.
"What is your background?"
It's irrelevant as I haven't said anything about seeking out a neighborhood populated by people of my own kind.
As for the vitriol, if you've read all of the posts from the professors and don't understand where it comes from, then I can't explain it to you.
"What neighborhood in SM gurantees that I'll by the furthest possibly from any east coast trained liberal academics?"
The more expensive ones, obviously. As the profs have admitted, even though they're incredibly overpaid for what they do, they don't make nearly enough to afford a decent lifestyle on the Westside.
The trailer park is probably the most likely place to find a UCLA prof (at least one who isn't over 70 years old).
I sense lots of bitterness from someone with a low SAT score.
Vitrol, bile, and hate for those who know how to think
Your senses are wrong. But think whatever you want in your ivory tower. Just know that us simple folk earn many times what you do. Talk about that at your next intellectual gathering at IHOP.
Nerd fight!
Goooooo! :-)
"The more expensive ones, obviously. As the profs have admitted, even though they're incredibly overpaid for what they do, they don't make nearly enough to afford a decent lifestyle on the Westside."
You guys crack me up. On the one hand you bitch about how important it is to live in the rich neighborhoods so that your offspring can get into the right high school so that they can go the right college, cause otherwise their whole life is going to be so screwed right from the start. On the other hand you mock the people who are supposed to teach your progeny.
"As the profs have admitted, even though they're incredibly overpaid for what they do, ..."
Who admitted that? I certainly didn't. Most of my colleagues in my department at UCLA put in 70+ hours a week. Not all of it in the classroom, for sure- most of it spent in the lab.
You guys most certainly have no idea what you're talking about- the fact that you slept through a few college courses doesn't make you an expert on higher education.
The people bashing professors are most likely the Fat hairy USC frat boy types - always either drunk or hungover or puking somewhere - go back to Manhattan Beach where you can cheer the USC Football team and leave us alone. This blog is about Santa Monica. Get out
"Anon said...
I want to know where I can live in a high-end area but also with access to plenty of single, young hot chicks."
LOL - I want to know where I can live in a high end area, close to the beach where the single young hot chicks walk into my house and give me handjobs. Anyone know where I can find this area? And for cheap???
east coast trained academic here:
i didn't mean to imply that being trained on the east coast made me any better than any other person on this blog. I really just meant that I've had a hard time finding neighborhoods in LA that are similar to some of my favorites in DC, Boston, or Philly. I used academic because I'm not a university professor. The sociologist/engineer debate is weird. Do you all really worry about how your disciplines compare?
I grew up living on the East Coast and got my degrees on the East Coast -
just relax. There is something strange in the water here in Santa Monica - it makes people very angry and competitive when it comes to education and real estate.
People here are obsessed with the status thing - north of montana vs south of montana.
Huge class and status markers at play -
Just relax and let it pass -
yeah, people on the East Coast aren't angry. Or obsessed with status. Ever.
The whole Monana avenue thing is freaky -
it's like the mason dixon line to these people
Never seen a people so obsessed with real estate - someone told me London was like this in 2007 -
May be just the people I work with in Santa Monica - they prattle on and on and on about their fantasy of living North of Montana -
it is just sick and twisted
90402 is an unhealthy obsession for those people
Abandon the Westside altogether. It is a zone for those with money but little else. Los Angeles is so spread out that it is difficult to find enclaves of anything anywhere but your best shot for concentrations of actual readers and thinkers will be Los Feliz, Silverlake and Pasadena.
Good advice
forget the West Side
I make $300,000 a year.
I need a good automatic coupe, no frills. I can easily afford a BMW, or Benz... but the SLR McLaren is just an automatic coupe... no real serious frills there, it isn't even all that innovatively designed. I should be able to afford a good middle class car. The SLR McLaren should be a good middle class car.
Prices are going to have to come down so that middle class earners like me can afford middle class cars like the SLR McLaren. And until the bubble deflates on the SLR McLaren market we'll know the time is not yet right to buy!
Excellent parody of the thinking here
But just keep in mind that only a very very small percentage of the people that post here feel like they deserve to live North of Montana -
yes there are plenty of people here who think they should be able to afford the west side and not the valley but very few that feel they deserve to live North of Montana
The issue is that plenty of people grew up on the West Side, with an implied understanding that they could always afford the West Side.
Never ever before this recent bubble was it the case that someone with a solid upper middle class job like accountant or engineer could not afford ANYTHING on the west side
until this bubble, an accountant or engineer could always find SOME hood on the west side they could afford
not anymore - EVERYTHING west of the 405 is too expensive to afford - absolutely everything
this is new
"yes there are plenty of people here who think they should be able to afford the west side and not the valley but very few that feel they deserve to live North of Montana"
Yes, I agree- it's ridiculous that someone with a $150K+ salary cannot afford even a modest 2 BR house ANYWHERE on the Westside. That's the real issue, and the indicator why we're still in a bubble- forget the 90402.
In my opinion the people complaining about not being able to afford to live North of Montana make $500 thousand a year and are angry that they can't afford North of Montana on $500k
The people making $150k a year complain about other neighborhoods - the $150k crowd has completely thrown in the towel on the North of Montana fantasy and are instead pushing to afford other places on the West Side
you have BOTH crowds here complaining - they are just complaining about other things
In my opinion the people complaining about not being able to afford to live North of Montana make $500 thousand a year and are angry that they can't afford North of Montana on $500k
My HH is about $500k a year, and I live in 90403. I don't give a crap about 90402 or the next move up. My SFR tax basis is in the $700's, I'm halfway through a 30 year mortgage, and I have healthy savings for retirement. Moving up to 90402 would mean a new 30 year mortgage, higher taxes, fewer great vacations, etc - overall lower cash flow for living. God bless the folks who have the means and desire to live big; my neighbors and I are content right where we are, and sleep well at night.
Hi! I'm a hot, shaved, young cheerleader over at UCLA and I heard that there are east-coast trained academics hanging out here! I'm sick of dating all those lecherous I-bankers young law-firm partners I keep meeting in the clubs and would love to cuddle up to a droky, pasty-faced, four-eyed, entitled, vegetable-eating academic.
"Hi! I'm a hot, shaved, young cheerleader over at UCLA ..."
Wow, you must have too much time at your hands. Yawn.
I like my superficial neighbors. I never feel challenged.
I agree with anonymous June 20 10:31 p.m.. I bought a house in the less desirable east end of West Hollywood 16 years ago, paid it off in ten years and since then, on a mere $150K a year, am accumulating a cash stash that is currently the same size as the 16-years-ago purchase price for that house, plus I go on really nice overseas vacations and can indulge in a handful of vintage cars. Climbing the real estate ladder is a chump's race. I'm waiting out the bubble so that I can safeguard an early retirement with one or two rental properties. And at least one will be bought with cash.
I must admit I am amazed that people have time to get to know their neighbors. My husband and I lived in the same small complex (12 units) for over 9 years and I can honestly say I haven't met or seen all my neighbors let alone know what they do for a living.
Sounds like you and your husband aren't that outgoing. I've been in my neighborhood for 1.5 years and I am very familiar with most of my neighbors. A couple of them are not my favorite people on this earth, but at least I found that out.
Anon at 11:29 pretty much sums up what this yawnfest of a thread has been. One big nerd-fight among academics who have no clue that they're not as smart as those who earn a lot more than they do, and yet they feel entitled to live on the Westside.
I with anon 9:47am. We also don't have the inclination to meet our neighbors--we both grew up in the LA area so we have plenty of friends to socialize with already. Plus with two young kids, two full time professional jobs, family obligations on weekends, etc... we don't have the time either. However, if I was single and new to the neighborhood that would be another story.
My wife is UCLA faculty (Clinician Educator in Medicine). We live in Rancho Park along with a lot of her peers. There are a lot of UCLA folks with families in our area. Pico near the park is nice and walkable and we can get to Westwood in about 20 minutes of walking. I really like the combo of being close to roads/freeways, but not having to use them for our local shopping and family errands.
Our neighbors are mostly professionals, but there is a high concentration of UCLA folks between Sepulveda and Beverly Glen between Santa Monica and Pico.
"... they feel entitled to live on the Westside."
Yes, oh well. The Westside- heaven on earth. It only takes $1.5 million to pay for a decrepit old 2 BR shack in a marginal location in Santa Monica, and you're in the club. Earn like a king, live like a pauper.
Ah yes, these dumb academics. They actually still think it's prudent to spend <10x your annual income on a mortgage, and save for something as unimportant, like retirement, or health insurance.
I love it- the bubble mindset is still in full swing on here.
Anon at 1:36
You missed the point of that post. It's not that anyone should stretch to 10x income to live on the westside, it's that academics earning less than $150k think they're entitled to live there. I'm at a very stable $280k (and NOT double income) and I don't think I'm entitled to afford to live on the westside, so it galls me how entitled these academics are. Maybe that's why they're still in school.
I've got a question for you guys:
When all the 5/1 loans that so many people took to buy at the top start adjusting in 2010, 2011, and 2012, are these people going to get crunched by massive monthly payment increases, or are they going to be able to refinance at roughly the same monthly payment they currently have?
It's not about being "entitled" to live on the westside, it's about being lucky enough to have bought pre-2000 or stupid enough to have bought since.
How everyone conveniently forgets what happened to the westside between 1989 and 1996 never ceases to amaze me.
And this bubble was MUCH bigger and the unemployment situation in socal is MUCH worse this time.
Prices on the westside still have 50 percent to drop. That's right, 50 percent. Take it to the bank. (If the bank is still in business.)
Don't believe all the nonsense posted here by Realtor trolls. They're either deceitful or retarded. Usually both.
"It's not about being "entitled" to live on the westside, it's about being lucky enough to have bought pre-2000 or stupid enough to have bought since."
I totally agree. This is not a question of entitlement. For me, as UCLA faculty, the issue is simple: if I can't afford housing in a good school district on the Westside, broadly interpreted, then I'll look for employment at a university in another part of the country. And I'll talk my federally funded grant with me, as well as my lab staff (who'd be happy to work in a place where they can actually afford to live).
I can't see why anyone can believe that it's reasonable that Westside prices shoot up 200%+ within a few years, and then complain that somone feels "entitled" if they don't buy into this bubble.
And trust me, I know of many people who stretched themselves (maybe not 10x annual income) to buy on the Westside, and who are not particularly happy now.
Professors and other that don't like the price of housing on the West Side:
You are correct to look to other parts of the USA for employment
there are plenty of cities that offer edgy interesting people, good amenities and restaurants and culture, for one quarter the price of the west side.
Don't let the mindless realtor scum badger you in to buying -
Santa Monica is a spectacular place to live for those that can easily buy in Santa Monica for 2 times their annual income.
If you can't buy in Santa Monica for two times your annual income move to another metroplex. you will be happier that way
I can't understand the anger toward academics on this thread. It's seems to come from nowhere and has degenerated into pure foolishness. Did an academic, at some point on this thread, declare that they were "entitled" to live on the west side? I can't find it, but some angry posters seem to have made it their conclusion.
there is just one person posting here that bashes the academics
that person is a troll - just ignore him and he will go away.
academics are just like other highly educated professionals here in Southern California - they really want to live in Santa Monica and they can't afford it.
Just like other professionals that can't afford santa monica the academics are finding other places to live - some of them are moving away from California and others are moving to cheaper neighborhoods
That is how it goes - most people find a place they can afford and move there
The academic is the one acting all entitled, not the troll.
He says if he can't buy a house here he'll take his federally funded grant and go elsewhere. Ooh, please, mr brilliant, please please stay, we beg you!
what a jerk-off you are. take your money and get the f out of here then, and don't let the 405 hit you on the way out.
who gives a crap if you can live here or not. you don't think there's people who work at ucla and live in the valley? hell, there's plenty of people who commute to ucla every day from orange county. if you don't want to be one of them then good riddance, you snotty douchebag.
i'm not against academics, i'm only against this one retarded academic who thinks he's better than everyone else because he has a phd. in fact, please go, so my kids don't get stuck having you as a prof one day with your snotty douchebag attitudes.
Go teach in Kansas so you can have a nice victorian house three miles from your office for $179,000. what's keeping you? Go. Goodbye. Get out of here you moron.
"Don't believe all the nonsense posted here by Realtor trolls. They're either deceitful or retarded. Usually both."
I approve this message by anon at 6:14.
Arti
What I find funny about academics is that they really, truly think they are smarter and/or better educated than professionals in fields like law or finance. Some of us in those careers have spent lifetimes pursuing both general and esoteric interests to a depth and understanding that the so-called academic has no clue about. And often over multiple fields.
They publish an article or two and they get to teach college students, all of which is great, until it gets to their heads and then they mistake self-importance and expertise in one field for being "academic" and "interesting". I know a producer, for example, that knows enough about Byzantine history to teach it, and a lawyer that knows more about modern western philosophy than many a grad student.
What makes them so likeable, however, is that they don't incessently talk about their interests like the academics who love the smell of their own farts. Instead they are well-rounded and are edgy enough to hang with my kind of fast crowd. The academics who can't keep up with the edgier side of LA should perhaps seek refuge in Boston or San Francisco, you don't have to be cool or good looking on top of smart in those cities.
I am the person who wrote the comment on June 22, 2009 8:37 PM, and I'm a bit flabbergasted by the hateful response it has created. Apparently this struck a nerve for a few people. I didn't suggest that I was better or more educated or otherwise entitled. It seems that whoever writes anything on this blog (liberals, conservatives, lawyers, ... or, god forbid, realtors) gets immediately bullied and insulted by someone. Not my idea of a civilized discussion, but whatever. I'm apparently not part of that "kind of fast crowd".
I was simply venting my frustration about the fact that LA, within a relatively short span of ten years, has become a place that is so expensive to live that it won't be able to support a world-class university for much longer, if this insanity continues. It has always been more expensive, for sure- but it now has come to the point where it's become difficult for us to attract quality faculty (back when we were still hiring ...) because of it. It's hard to convey to a potential star candidate that he or she will have to endure the commute in and out of the Valley in order to come to UCLA.
Anyway, nobody on here has so far given me a good argument (except hateful ad hominem attacks) why it should be a god-given fact that within 5 years the Westside went from being accessible, at least to double-income highly educated professional couples, to one where said couple can't afford even a 2 BR hovel.
"academics are just like other highly educated professionals here in Southern California - they really want to live in Santa Monica and they can't afford it."
That's exactly my stance. Except that I would like to at least include PP, Westwood, Brentwood and Mar Vista in this statement.
I would argue that despite your Byzantine expert producer friend and your lawyer buddy who is well versed in modern western philosophy, academics ARE in fact better educated than non-academics. Intelligence is another matter. I would like professors to be able to live in my neighborhood - hey, I'm not in 90402, but 90405 is still out of reach unless they have unique situations such as working spouses or family cash. It enriches the neighborhood. I just don't want lawyers as neighbors. They are always causing a ruckus about something like bushes encroaching a property line.
Anon 12.30 - I really don't know why people on this blog - and other Westside blogs - get so bent out of shape about stuff.
Maybe they honestly believe that people who don't fit into a certain class/income bracket shouldn't bother with SM and environs. Maybe they're personally affected, and their desperation is making them mean. Who knows.
And, to all those haters out there - you might think that UCLA is pointless and elitist, but it keeps most of West LA and Westwood open - everything from bars, restaurants. movies to bus lines and apartment buildings. Without the students that go there, the Westside would be a poorer and less 'prime' place without the student dollars making it possible.
And, I'm sorry to hear that you're thinking you might have to up sticks out of L.A all together. Bob knows we need more research in this country - and LA loses a lot when people such as you find yourself getting priced out of the area.
We're such a service industry society as it is, we need people who actually do more than litigate, run hedge funds and make skinny lattes.....
And, if you really want to live amongst your 'peers' and the idea of having to share a sidewalk with someone who doesn't make as much money as you makes you uncomfortable- guess what? There's plenty of gated communities all over the place that cater to that kind of lifestyle. You might find you're happier there than having to mix with the 'Hoi Polloi"
I think that your lawyer buddy who's read enough about western philosophy to impress his friends at a cocktail party notwithstanding, there goes more into getting tenure at a place like UCLA than to "publish an article or two": dedicated scholarship and hard work for decades.
Not to speak, of course, about what's needed to succeed in, say, mathematics or theoretical physics: talent, talent, talent. It's the same reason why not everyone is a musician- some people are gifted differently than others. Nothing to brag about, but that's what it is- some things you can't learn by just reading a lot.
so let me sum:
people with phds are "douchbags"
they don't work hard enough
they don't earn enough money to be your neighbor
they're not hot enough to be your neighbor
and it's strange that they even want to know their neighbors
does that answer the question of why we'd like to find an artistic/intellectual enclave?
It is just unfair.
The older professors (the ones 50 and above) were able to afford to live North of Montana. They bought in the 1970s when North of Montana was entirely affordable for a professor raising a family WITHOUT SPOUSE WORKING
let me repeat that so that it is clear - these older professors never had to ask their spouses to work - and they could still afford to quite comfortably buy in the 90402
Things have changes quite a lot - a neighborhood that professors could easily afford in the 1970s on a professor's salary is not out of reach, even if our spouse works
The point is that one generation of professors got what the next generation can never have
2:13 PM - you just made my day. That's one of the best comments I've seen in a long time. After all this nonsense it is good to look back at the original question.
"It is just unfair. The point is that one generation of professors got what the next generation can never have."
2:17 PM made my day. Looking for fairness - hahaha! Not in this century, not even with a Dem president. The New Deal is No Deal, except for the few who rise to the top through hard work, merit, and a bit of luck tossed in. Go ask the auto workers how their multi-generational gravy train is working out. Next up, public pension employees.
I would love to know what department the academic who started this whole thread is in.
Surely it's not political science, or economics, or anything that requires an understanding of the world around them.
"Soon this area won't be able to support a world class university because it's so expensive." Uh, so how have Columbia and NYU not shut down? Have you ever heard of a little school called Harvard that's located in an expensive city called Boston?
I mean, what kind of unsupported nonsense are you spewing? I hope your research is better supported than this. Maybe someone should go back and review some of the papers you've published.
The UCLA academic wrote:
"I was simply venting my frustration about the fact that LA, within a relatively short span of ten years, has become a place that is so expensive to live"
Yup, there was a housing bubble. Long denied nationally, now it's only denied on the westside of Los Angeles, because this is the last section of the balloon to still have some air in it.
Home prices don't simply triple in ten years no matter how nice the neighborhood. Current westside prices will fall another fifty percent from where they are today. That's right, fifty percent.
I know this will get many homeowners and most real estate agents in a tizzy and even foamy at the mouth, but it's inevitable.
The money to support this ascent was borrowed. When the time comes for it to be paid back, defaults will occur. A tremendous amount of homes will revert to possession of the banks who will have to slash their prices. That's what happened fifteen years ago and the problem is much, much bigger now.
Unemployment in California is the highest since World War 2 and only headed upward for the next two to three years. Hard to pay your mortgage when you don't have a job. Plus, so many people bought with little or no money down and adjustibles, yet alone option-arms, that when their five or seven year teaser period expires they will find themselves with a payment that's double or triple what they'd been paying. Most of these homes will be underwater at that point, ruling out refinancing as an option, and for those who aren't underwater, they'll never be able to qualify as easy as the first time because lending standards have tightened drastically.
This is a ten year process. What we have seen so far is only the tip of the iceberg. Things are bad and are only going to get worse from here. If, like me, you bought your house before 2000 you're okay. But the people who bought after that, especially in 2005, 2006, and 2007 are in for a rude awakening.
People who thought money grows on trees will learn that they're grandparents weren't crazy when they tried to teach them the value of a dollar.
Good luck to us all.
"let me repeat that so that it is clear - these older professors never had to ask their spouses to work - and they could still afford to quite comfortably buy in the 90402"
Well one of the reasons for the real estate boom nationally over the past two decades, and one no one ever wants to mention because of the political correctness ramifications, is that in the 70s true dual income couples were relatively rare. They are now very common. This enhancement to "household wealth" basically created more competition for the better neighborhoods, driving prices up.
No one wants to mention that because they're afraid they'll be accused of beign chauvinist or wishing we didn't have the advances to womens' rights that we have had. I leave it to the busybodies on the left and the retrogrades on the right to get riled up about this, my point is simply that dual income became a fact and that drove prices up nationally. This is not new to those of you who have read the many works published on this subject. But it answers (partly) the question one academic had about why the older professors could afford what they now cannot.
On a corollary point, I think those households that rely on that second income to afford a mortgage are making a grave mistake. They pay a very high price for that second income in other ways, in terms of childcare, education, and the utter lack of flexibility that you can have when the second earner has the option to go part time or take a few years off or just quit and focus on the family's well-being. Double earners also have double the work tension--moving to advance career, who works harder, whose job takes priority, etc. It's pathetic. If you *need* both incomes to afford a house, you probably should look for a lower priced house that one earner could afford alone.
I love that my fiancee works and makes that extra money, but it's critical that I could afford the mortgage alone and I don't *need* to make her work because I'm too weak an earner to cover the nut by myself.
"Uh, so how have Columbia and NYU not shut down? Have you ever heard of a little school called Harvard that's located in an expensive city called Boston?"
In case you're not aware of the little difference- all these places are PRIVATE universities, not PUBLIC (with Harvard being the richest of all). And I know for a fact that in my field NYU has lost people (to Cornell, for example) because of horrendous cost of living. Plus, one should keep in mind that excellent public transport in the cities you mention makes it much easier for people to live in one (cheaper) place and work in another. Something that's out of the question in LA, where even the typical commute from Culver City to UCLA takes 35 minutes (and much more if traffic is bad, which it often is).
I for one am glad to see the UCLA professors leave los angeles. These professors are overwhelmingly liberals that are in favor of amnesty for the massive number of illegals in LA.
These liberals ruined the West Side with their immigration policies. Their passing from our city will not be mourned
"These liberals ruined the West Side with their immigration policies."
What kind of logic is that? The West Side is so expensive because of illegal immigrants?
"I for one am glad to see the UCLA professors leave los angeles."
No UCLA professors = no UCLA. Are you saying we should do without universities? Welcome back to the agrarian age.
Why are you playing dumb ?
2:26 is correct. The liberal immigration policies led one million illegals to move to the Los Angeles area. as a result, most of the formerly decent areas outside of the West Side are now scummy.
No professional would be willing to send his kids to school in an area other than the West Side. Therefore all the professionals in LA that want a safe clean environment for their kids to grow up in have to move to the West Side
Competition to get in to the West Side drove up prices.
Before this wave of illegal immigration, Hollywood ( just to name one example) was a fine place to live and raise a family
So yes, the UCLA professors are responsible for the wave of illegal immigrants that have made most of los angeles a dump.
And in case you haven't noticed, our state is rapidly approaching bankruptcy due to the illegals.
Do the math. one illegal family with three kids costs us $40 thousand a year in public school costs and $15 thousand a year in health care costs. $55 thousand a year per illegal family.
Explain to me how that is not the fault of the UCLA profs and how that is not leading our state to BK
I love how the liberal UCLA professor types on this blog always talk about how excited they are to have more diversity, and yet whenever they go to buy a house they admit that they really want to live in the least diverse places.
Hey professors why don't you try eating some of your own cooking - go live in a "diverse" neighborhood
"Explain to me how that is not the fault of the UCLA profs and how that is not leading our state to BK"
Wow, we've finally identified the culprits for the mess we're in! It was not a mind boggling housing bubble that made (almost) everyone in CA delusional with greed. No, it's the fault of the UCLA faculty. So round up those UCLA profs. Open those concentration camps now, and start the re-education to fiscal conservatism and traditional family-values. Just like Gov. Sanford over on the other coast demonstrates them to us every day.
This is sort of a befuddling thread.
The UCLA professors come on this blog and explain that they desperately want to live in Brentwood, North Santa Monica, and PP.
At the same time, these UCLA professors are loudly advocating for amnesty for the one million illegals now living in Los Angeles.
What is wrong with this picture? The UCLA professors want the illegals to stay, but the UCLA professors don't want to live with the illegals - it is clear that the UCLA profs want some other Angelinos to send their kids to school with the illegals ("diversity")
to all the UCLA profs, I politely say, get out of our city. Move back to New York and Boston. You have done enough damage to us already
"At the same time, these UCLA professors are loudly advocating for amnesty for the one million illegals now living in Los Angeles."
So you have done a representative survey of the political opinions of the UCLA faculty? Please link it on here, so that we may study it. Ah but wait, I overlooked- "it is clear," as you say. Doesn't need proof.
"to all the UCLA profs, I politely say, get out of our city."
No UCLA profs = no UCLA. So then your kids don't need to go to college, either? You're the modern equivalent of a caveman.
Look can we bring this blog back to sanity?
All of us on this blog want to live on the West Side.
We all know what the rest of Los Angeles is like and we all know why the West Side is a better place to live than the rest of Los Angeles.
The discussion of college professors is over
It is a very legitimate point that the typical liberal loves diversity, but if they can afford it they're going to live in the most exclusive neighborhoods. Kind of hypocritical, no?
It is more specific than that - the UCLA professors are liberals that pushed for diversity - one million illegals to move to LA.
As a result of the one million illegals from south of the border moving to LA, many neighborhoods East of the 405 are not what they used to be.
Now that the UCLA professors have made most of LA diverse - the UCLA professors have gotten what they wanted and filled most of LA with immigrants from south of the border the UCLA professors want to live in neighborhoods that contain NO illegals from south of the border
the UCLA profs on this blogs want to live in PP and Brentwood.
The UCLA profs are the worst kind of hypocrites. Look what they have done to our city and our state
Wow! Where did all the racists on this blog come from?! (Actually, I suspect it's just one loony racist with multiple postings.) And yeah, I know you don't consider yourself a racist, but of course you are. I suppose you have nothing but the highest regard for Latino immigrants who live here legally, right?
Not to mention your braindead analysis of two-earner families. People don't have more income because their wives work, people have more income because of President George W. Bush's policies that spread the wealth -- upwards. Have you been living under a rock the past ten years? Or is it that you just don't read a newspaper.
Wow- can we end this discussion right now
This board is for people that want to live on the West Side. It doesn't matter why we want to live on the West Side each of us has his own reason
It is not even relevant - let's just discuss w side real estate
Anon 10:28 -- your fiancee? Holy moly, what a mistake that poor girl is making! If you're reading this blog by any chance sweetheart... run! You are marrying the biggest loser I've come across in a long, long time.
It's definitely more than one "loony" posting, I can assure you. And I for one am definitely not a racist- I married an immigrant, one who came here LEGALLY, learned English and became a citizen. The illegal aliens are here illegally and should be deported, and it's not racist to believe as such.
"The UCLA profs are the worst kind of hypocrites. Look what they have done to our city and our state"
Yes- round up the intelligentsia and put them against the wall. The old adage.
You have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. UCLA is one of the biggest employers on the Westside- if you wish it away you wish away a major economic force in LA. Not everyone can be a screenwriter.
By the way- it's perfectly possible to be mostly liberal AND yet to be against illegal immigration. I think I belong to that category. But one thing I am not- a xenophobe and illiterate like you.
Sorry,
you have your facts wrong. The tenured professors at UCLA vote for amnesty for the illegals here in LA.
Spend a little time with the professors. Get the facts.
Amnesties lead to more illegals coming in - which leads to more amnesties -
The professors at UCLA are the worst kind of scum. They have ruined most neighborhoods East of the 405 and now these professor scumbags scurry West of the 405 to escape the mess they made.
And yes it is possible to be progressive, vote progressive, and donate to progressive causes the way I do and still regard the UCLA profs as the lowest of the low for what they have done to our city.
UCLA profs should stay on the East Side of the 405 and send their kids to the disgusting public schools that they created with their immigration policies
Sometimes I wonder whether this blog can still be saved.
Back to discussing real estate only please
i'm educated, i'm liberal, and I vote
i'm not going anywhere, this is my city now
why don't you leave, and take your racist xenophobia with you
you, bush and the rest of the murdering torturers can have the entire middle of this country where you can study the bible, build a wall, and destroy your own constitution
i'd rather have a hardworking undocumented neighbor than a small minded bigot like you
i don't care how much of your tax dollars it takes to feed, cloth, educate, and care for people unlucky enough not to be born here
Please UCLA professors - we have heard you. You don't have to repeat yourself. We know where you stand. Now back to real estate !
I've been coming back to this thread every day for its comedic value.
Google it -
the professors at Harvard are laughing at what the UCLA professors did to us here in LA.
Read professor Putnam's condemnation of the UCLA professors here :
"A bleak picture of the corrosive effects of ethnic diversity has been revealed in research by Harvard University's Robert Putnam, one of the world's most influential political scientists. His research shows that the more diverse a community is, the less likely its inhabitants are to trust anyone—from their next-door neighbor to the mayor."
"In the presence of diversity, we hunker down," said Putnam. "We act like turtles. The effect of diversity is worse than had been imagined. And it's not just that we don't trust people who are not like us. In diverse communities, we don't trust people who do look like us." [Study paints bleak picture of ethnic diversity October 8, 2006]
"Professor Putnam," said the Financial Times, "found trust was lowest in Los Angeles, 'the most diverse human habitation in human history.'"
yes, we get it racists--you want racial harmony through separation. Wish granted--move to the suburbs or wyoming where there are no black, brown, poor people. We don't want you here.
I agree racists get out -
now let's get back to discussing real estate
Not a racist but certainly a classist. I dont like barrio dwellers any more or less than I do poor white trash. I discriminate against all of them.
However, I do like people who are educated, intelligent, etc. I choose to be around these people regardless of their skin color. Basically I judge people all the time, not "by the color of their skin but by the content of their character".
Ugh - this is not a blog about politics. Can't the UCLA professors go post somewhere else and let us Westsiders live in peace
"Ugh - this is not a blog about politics. Can't the UCLA professors go post somewhere else and let us Westsiders live in peace"
How about the other way around? Can't the xenophobes go watch Fox News and let us UCLA professor live in peace?
I had to laugh hard when I read the comment with the Professor Putnam quote. So you only like academics when you can bend their statements in your favor? Otherwise they are "scum", as you so lovingly called us. I see.
"by the color of their skin but by the content of their character".
and bank account too. right asshole?
This thread would've died 7 days ago but for the discussion started by the liberal brainwashers of young impressionable minds (aka sociology professors). To anyone who's complaining about that topic, why are you still coming to this thread? There are 3 or 4 new ones on this blog?
"and bank account too. right asshole?"
Pretty much. When unemployment hits 15% and the riots start, it won't be the people with money in the bank doing the damage. Poor people suck and should be avoided at all costs.
It's not a racial thing. Plenty of poor whites will turn to violent crime as the unemployment rates go up.
Don't forget that the state of California is bankrupt and won't pay welfare to any males, whether they are white or any other color.
How else is a male of any color going to survive except through violent crime?
that's why you want to be living in Rolling Hills or Hidden Hills - both large gated neighborhoods - for the next few years. The guards are there 24 /7 and are armed.
The violent criminals of all races will pass those neighborhoods by in favour of other neighborhoods.
The issue is unemployment, desperation and violent crime, not race.
By the way, the state will be releasing plenty of violent criminals of all races from prison early since it has run out of money
"that's why you want to be living in Rolling Hills or Hidden Hills - both large gated neighborhoods - for the next few years. The guards are there 24 /7 and are armed."
OK, so pleeease: why don't you move there right away, and leave us alone on this blog, so that we don't have to listen to your repetitive rants anymore.
yawn - every single person that posted on this thread is boring me
Post a Comment